Microlite2020?

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randalls
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Microlite2020?

Post by randalls » Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:57 am

It's been about 10 years since the original Microlite20 was released. I'm thinking that it might be time to revise the base game a bit -- a Microlite20 2.0 (or Microlite2020 because I wanted to be cute for this post). Seth spent several years working on his new version of Microlite20. He generally referred to it as Microlite20 Revised. Unfortunately, many of Seth's Microlite20 Revised drafts moved quite a long way from the 3.x SRD and hence were often very incompatible to completely incompatible with both 3.x and most of the many Microlite20 variants already written. I want Microlite20 2.0 to be mostly compatible with current stuff, so there are unlikely to be many major changes to the system.

That said here are some of the things I am thinking of changing:

1) Using a version of the Hit Points/Body Points system I use in many of my Microlite74/75/78/81 games. Body Points would be equal to STR, so it would be fairly compatible with the current version of M20 and its many variants. The critical hit system and healing systems would work like they do in my most of the above mentioned variants. Hit points would be considered "fatigue" while Body points would be actual wounds.

2) Replacing skills with the Background system from 13th Age (not the same as the background system I use in M74/75/78/81) which is basically a free-form broad skill system. This would make it possible to easily create a nearly infinite number of "subclasses" on the fly.

3) Making the system compatible with both 3.x type campaigns/adventures and TSR era campaigns an adventure. The main difference is the level bonuses are dived by 2 for TSR era adventures and bonuses normally max out at a total of +15 or so. It's easy enough to mention stuff like this in the game.

I'm open to additiona and other ideas, of course.

BTW, this would not be a replacement for the original Microlite20 -- just another option.

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RandallS
Playing and Gamemastering Tabletop RPGs Since 1975
Designer: Microlite74, Microlite75, Microlite78, Microlite81, Microlite20 OSS, and others
Compiler: The Microlite20 RPG Collection
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Re: Microlite2020?

Post by Snorb » Mon Sep 02, 2019 9:19 pm

Pathfinder: Second Edition came out last month; I mentioned on the Facebook page that it uses tiered training levels instead of 5e's proficiency bonus. Characters basically gain opportunities to improve their skill training level about every second level. This does sound like something I'd integrate in an m20 game.

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I wrote stuff:
The ArrrPG - A game about pirates.
Nakama: A Game of Magical Girls - A game about being Sailor Moon ripoffs PARODIES.
Intervigilum - A PbtA-ish game about being knights against the Dark.


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Re: Microlite2020?

Post by sycarion » Thu Sep 05, 2019 4:50 pm

2) Replacing skills with the Background system from 13th Age (not the same as the background system I use in M74/75/78/81) which is basically a free-form broad skill system. This would make it possible to easily create a nearly infinite number of "subclasses" on the fly.

I like this idea. It opens up skills a bit without creating 25 pages of skill descriptions. It also feels a bit like 2e kits.

I also like using a character creation system like this that doesn't give bonuses for Race, but for class.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/563-rei ... ity-scores

That's my 2 cents.

I like the idea of M2020.

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Re: Microlite2020?

Post by randalls » Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:52 am

sycarion wrote:
Thu Sep 05, 2019 4:50 pm

I also like using a character creation system like this that doesn't give bonuses for Race, but for class.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/563-rei ... ity-scores

I read the entire article, but it lost me with respect to Microlite, in the first paragraph:

There are over 1,000 unique race/class combinations in fifth edition D&D, but only a small handful of them are worth playing from a character optimization standpoint.

Microlite20 does not have enough mechanical bits and bobs to appeal to people who want to charop. In fact, meaningful charop is almost impossible in Microlite20 (and most of its variants). I think this is a huge plus for Microlite20 -- system mastery is not needed to create a playable and enjoyable character. Therefore, this article really does not seem very applicable to Microlite20 to me. Also, if you remove the attribute adjustments for race from Microlite20, all races basically become humans with some minor appearance differences. In my experience, at least, few people want that.

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RandallS
Playing and Gamemastering Tabletop RPGs Since 1975
Designer: Microlite74, Microlite75, Microlite78, Microlite81, Microlite20 OSS, and others
Compiler: The Microlite20 RPG Collection
Administrator: Microlite20 Nexus


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Re: Microlite2020?

Post by randalls » Fri Sep 06, 2019 2:47 pm

Here is an extremely early draft of Microlite2020. Backgrounds and HP/BP added. Minor changes to combat rules to adjust for HP/BP. Minor change to Advancement rules for Backgrounds.

Attachments
Microlite2020-Draft01.pdf
VERY early Microlite2020 Draft (V01)
(688.62 KiB) Downloaded 56 times
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RandallS
Playing and Gamemastering Tabletop RPGs Since 1975
Designer: Microlite74, Microlite75, Microlite78, Microlite81, Microlite20 OSS, and others
Compiler: The Microlite20 RPG Collection
Administrator: Microlite20 Nexus


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Re: Microlite2020?

Post by sycarion » Fri Sep 06, 2019 3:54 pm

Microlite20 does not have enough mechanical bits and bobs to appeal to people who want to charop. In fact, meaningful charop is almost impossible in Microlite20 (and most of its variants). I think this is a huge plus for Microlite20 -- system mastery is not needed to create a playable and enjoyable character. Therefore, this article really does not seem very applicable to Microlite20 to me. Also, if you remove the attribute adjustments for race from Microlite20, all races basically become humans with some minor appearance differences. In my experience, at least, few people want that.

I should've summarized my idea, I apologize.

Essentially, choosing a race provides a minor ability instead of a total of +2 Stat Adjustments. For example, a Dwarf gets stonecunning or extra encumbrance.
Then when you choose the class, The class would provide a bonus to stats. For example, a Fighter would get a +2 to STR for a swordsman or maybe even a +2 to DEX for an archer.
Then a background per your 13th Age idea. The background could even differentiate between a Mage and a Cleric.

Race makes a character unique by ability instead of a stat. The stat is added to the basic role of a character (Good with weapons, Good with sneaky things, Good with magic). The background provides for a myriad of 'subclasses".

Just my 2 cents. I will read over the early draft and let you know what I think.

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Re: Microlite2020?

Post by sycarion » Fri Sep 06, 2019 5:50 pm

Here is an extremely early draft of Microlite2020. Backgrounds and HP/BP added. Minor changes to combat rules to adjust for HP/BP. Minor change to Advancement rules for Backgrounds.

I like this a lot. Not too different from M20, but lots of ways to customize things without zillions of pages of skill descriptions.

My question is, "Do we need the four skills now that we have backgrounds?". Although it feels redundant to me, I may be missing something.

My ideas are:

  1. Thinking about my earlier post and this draft, we could allow a race to be a choice of a 3 point background from a list instead of Stat Adjustments.
  2. The Classes would be the traditional Fighter (Martial), Rogue (Sneaky), Mage (Arcane), Cleric (Divine). They would provide a stat adjustment and a special ability.
  3. Thinking about PF2, it could be in their ABC order of Ancestry (Race), Background, Class. We don't have to use their names, just a thing with me that I like ABC to explain character creation.

So making a character would be

1. Choose a race and one skill from that race's list:
Dwarf - Tunnel Scout, Stonework, Mining, Smith, Ogre Killer
Elf - Woodsman, animal trainer, fae noble, magecraft, refugee
Halfling - chef, herbalist, scout, con-woman
Human - Adaptable (+1 to all skill rolls), thief, alchemist, soldier, aristocratic noble

2. Assign Background Points:
Assign 8 points to two or more backgrounds. A background can have a max of 5 to start.

3. Choose a class
Fighter - Can use any armor and shields. Martial Ability - +1 to all attack and damage rolls, increase +1 per five levels. +2 to STR
Rogue - Can use light armor. Sneak Attack - On successful Sneak, can use appropriate background rank to the damage of the first attack +2 to DEX
Magi - Can not use armor. Arcane Spellcasting - Can cast arcane spells +2 MIND
Cleric - Can wear up to medium armor. Divine Spellcasting - Can cast divine spells. Turn Undead - Successful Magic attack vs. current Hit points of Undead turns them. If DC is exceeded by 10 or more, the undead are destroyed. +2 MIND

Sample Characters
Morris, Human Rogue - 1
STR 12 (+1), DEX 15 (+2), MIND 12 (+1)
hp 13 AC 15 (Studded Leather), Paired Shortswords, +0/+0, d6+1
Abilities: Sneak Attack
Backgrounds: Cat Burglar 5, Scout 3 Thief 3

Kendrick, Dwarf Fighter - 1
STR 16 (+3), DEX 13 (+1), MIND 11 (+0)
hp 17 AC 17 (Chain mail + Shield), Longsword, +5, d8+4
Abilities: Martial Ability (+1 dmg/att)
Backgrounds: Tunnel Scout 5, Mining 3, Smith 3

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Re: Microlite2020?

Post by TyroneSlothrop » Fri Sep 06, 2019 5:52 pm

Sounds like a great update - I've always been a fan of the mass combat and whilst I appreciate the abstraction (using the scaling factor), I'm wondering if it would be possible to add any additional examples or templates pls? If complexity around body parts are going to be added, wondering if an equivalent for mass combat could be flanking or attack from the rear to apply additional modifiers?

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randalls
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Re: Microlite2020?

Post by randalls » Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:03 pm

sycarion wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 5:50 pm

My question is, "Do we need the four skills now that we have backgrounds?". Although it feels redundant to me, I may be missing something.

They will be gone (at least in initial playtest versions, if not having them breaks things they will probably have to return in some form). I just haven't edited all references to them out of the draft rules yet. They should be mostly gone in Draft 2 -- mostly because I'm sure I miss at least one somewhere. I'm horrible at anything resembling proofreading. :oops:

1. Thinking about my earlier post and this draft, we could allow a race to be a choice of a 3 point background from a list instead of Stat Adjustments.

  1. The Classes would be the traditional Fighter (Martial), Rogue (Sneaky), Mage (Arcane), Cleric (Divine). They would provide a stat adjustment and a special ability.
  2. Thinking about PF2, it could be in their ABC order of Ancestry (Race), Background, Class. We don't have to use their names, just a thing with me that I like ABC to explain character creation.

After seeing what you are thinking, I'm impressed and willing to give it a try and see what playtesters think. However, I will want to impress on players in the rules that their GM can and should change the lists of free background selections for each race to fit their campaign -- that the ones listed in the rules are just an example designed with a bog standard RPG fantasy world in mind.

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RandallS
Playing and Gamemastering Tabletop RPGs Since 1975
Designer: Microlite74, Microlite75, Microlite78, Microlite81, Microlite20 OSS, and others
Compiler: The Microlite20 RPG Collection
Administrator: Microlite20 Nexus


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Re: Microlite2020?

Post by randalls » Fri Sep 06, 2019 9:05 pm

TyroneSlothrop wrote:
Fri Sep 06, 2019 5:52 pm

Sounds like a great update - I've always been a fan of the mass combat and whilst I appreciate the abstraction (using the scaling factor), I'm wondering if it would be possible to add any additional examples or templates pls? If complexity around body parts are going to be added, wondering if an equivalent for mass combat could be flanking or attack from the rear to apply additional modifiers?

I don't do much mass combat, but I'm open to suggestions. There definitely will be some modifiers for things like flanking and attacks from the rear. Exactly how to make it work will require some playtesting. Would you be up for some of that?

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RandallS
Playing and Gamemastering Tabletop RPGs Since 1975
Designer: Microlite74, Microlite75, Microlite78, Microlite81, Microlite20 OSS, and others
Compiler: The Microlite20 RPG Collection
Administrator: Microlite20 Nexus


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